Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

All discussion related to the Crimson Dark webcomic (at crimsondark.com)
charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:14 pm

"Focus fire on the Coalition destroyers."

Aren't the Coalition ships, two Battleships and a Light Carrier?

Source is only your comment for this page: http://www.davidcsimon.com/crimsondark/ ... rip_id=464

Very good design, considering its the first fully designed warship of the Alliance (or at least the first fully designed one in this war). The other ships are all refitted or modified civillian ship designs from memory. Never-the-less it'll be interesting to see how calm they remain if a lance from the Tempest or Vashnir manages to take off the whole nose of the ship *lol* (actually, the last panel seems to show the Vashnir lining them up). I'm guessing that she's designed to front up into battle. I'd dread to think how much more vulnerable she might be on her rear. The flanks are probably pretty safe with those hangers on either side (although I doubt the air-support crew stationed in the hangers would agree), but top, bottom and back of the ship's middle rear are likely to be some key points. Makes sense that Novosi has her ships preventing the enemy from getting to the rear and her most powerful escorts, the Heavy Cruisers, above and below the Milowka.

If the Cirins did loose the ship in this engagement, it'd be a pretty heavy psychological blow. The cirins had been targeting the Tempest battleships because of their symbolic significance to the Daranir. I doubt a Sparrow class carrier has been destroyed yet and there are likely to be no more than three of them, if there's even that many, yet.

Really though, the UTC battleships are likely doomed with their broad flanks facing the Cirin Vorstok destroyers. Those Vorstoks have TWO lances facing forward to point at those ship's juicy sides. The Tempest battleship is probably lined up with the Gerushda's lance, so it and the Heavy cruiser on the underside of the Milowka are likely to prove nasty for it. Their only chance at a counter strategy now is to break through the Milowka and get enough distance on the rest of the Cirin fleet to turn around and make another approach.

As big as the UTC and Daranir are Its looking like a total loss for them here and it's likely to be a fairly catastrophic one. A Darani battleship and two UTC battleships is a costly loss. Unless the Sirius gets away its likely to be absolutely devastating. Despite their size, I doubt the UTC has THAT many battships to spare. It'll also be a major moral boost for the Cirins who were likely to feel disheartened at the involvement of the Coalition and see it as a sign of certain defeat against an enemy that now outmatches them significantly. But the seemingly undefeatable UTC ships and their technology will also be viewed as vulnerable now and demoralise the Coalition... or leave them stinking mad.
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Dhraakellian
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Dhraakellian » Tue Aug 23, 2011 1:43 am

javcs wrote:Sucks to be the crew who looses their quarters and rec areas afterwards, though, but, given the alternatives, it's not that bad.
Bad day to sleep in, it would seem (disciplinary measures aside).
charles wrote:If the Cirins did loose the ship in this engagement, it'd be a pretty heavy psychological blow. The cirins had been targeting the Tempest battleships because of their symbolic significance to the Daranir. I doubt a Sparrow class carrier has been destroyed yet and there are likely to be no more than three of them, if there's even that many, yet.
Yeah, those shiny new Tempests "were supposed to win the war" for the Darani.
charles wrote:As big as the UTC and Daranir are Its looking like a total loss for them here and it's likely to be a fairly catastrophic one.
Your assessment sounds quite optimistic. I want to agree with you, but my pessimism (realism?) streak says it can't be that easy. The Cirins are probably going to be licking their wounds too. At the very least, the Milowka is going to need a lot of repair work.
charles wrote:But the seemingly undefeatable UTC ships and their technology will also be viewed as vulnerable now and demoralise the Coalition... or leave them stinking mad.
Let's hope the good Admiral's speech pushes it more towards demoralization.

Aaand that inner pessimist just popped the phrase "scorched earth"* into my mind. Stinking mad or stinking spiteful?

* used in the generic sense of the wor(l)d
Some pithy statement goes here.

algesan
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by algesan » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:52 am

Yep, Cannae in the making. The reason for targeting the Destroyers (or other escort vessels that seem to be hanging back some) is that they are doing the screening for the heavies charging towards the center PLUS they are easier to kill and will degrade anti-fighter defenses fairly quickly (if the CD universe's ships behave like most SF space fleets) PLUS their loss will seem negligible to the leaders of the charging fleets. Until they start coming under shield strain by both flanking shots from all directions and/or upskirt shots into their engines. Then no matter which way they try to break and run, someone will get to hammer them up close in passing while taking increasing fire in the arse.

charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Tue Aug 23, 2011 3:34 pm

Dhraakellian wrote:
charles wrote:As big as the UTC and Daranir are Its looking like a total loss for them here and it's likely to be a fairly catastrophic one.
Your assessment sounds quite optimistic. I want to agree with you, but my pessimism (realism?) streak says it can't be that easy. The Cirins are probably going to be licking their wounds too. At the very least, the Milowka is going to need a lot of repair work.
As Algesan says below. Cannae in the making. Novosi figured this as a "fair fight" and Cannae had Hannibal terribly outnumbered and outmatched but with the near perfect execution of a pincer movement, he desimated the Romans. Novosi appears to have pulled off the perfect pincer of her own and, provided the Milowka can hold up, the UTC and Darani are doomed.

I'm thinking the Sirius might be far back enough to back out of this before the pincers close on it though. Loosing that ship would really hurt.
algesan wrote:Yep, Cannae in the making. The reason for targeting the Destroyers (or other escort vessels that seem to be hanging back some) is that they are doing the screening for the heavies charging towards the center PLUS they are easier to kill and will degrade anti-fighter defenses fairly quickly (if the CD universe's ships behave like most SF space fleets) PLUS their loss will seem negligible to the leaders of the charging fleets. Until they start coming under shield strain by both flanking shots from all directions and/or upskirt shots into their engines. Then no matter which way they try to break and run, someone will get to hammer them up close in passing while taking increasing fire in the arse.
But the Coalition don't have any destroyers there. Only two Battships and the Light Carrier. The only destroyer there is the Darani Vashnir. The best non-lance guns appear to be the tripple Heracles 85L Guns of which the Darani Battleship has 8 (although their current position means that they can only bring about 3 of those to point at the Milowka... Probably for the better since they'll want the other 5 to deal with the Daimyo Heavy cruiser and Gerushda Destroyer beneath them.) But it also has a heavy lance, so presuming the UTC battleships are at least as powerful as her, they'd have the really nasty cap-killing weaponry that you want taken out. Except for the vashnir the escorts are light-weights with 50L guns on that one O'Brien and 30L guns on the Taratanes. The guns on the Darani Carrier would be lucky to threaten the Scarborough or Niobe.

But you are right about the anti-fighter defences. Its good to make sure that any fighter making a line for the big ships is sandwiched between the AA of escorts and primary ships... Nasty. The Alliance fighters aren't significant but they have some serious cap killing ordinance on those bombers.
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Knowles2
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Knowles2 » Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:16 am

I would not under estimate the alliance fleet chances , depending on exactly how big the gap between the Sparrow and escort are, if I was in charge of the allied fleet I would pull into a tighter formation and accelerate to full speed, punch right through the middle of the formation, once clear, turn around a hit the opposing fleet in the rear, aiming for there engines an other targets.

An also I suspect the allied fleet has got reinforcements close by. Remember the Novosi was expecting more cirin ships to be in orbit, but they are no where to be seen, I bet they were dispatch to somewhere else and replace by the UTC fleet, if those ships are nearby the Cirin fleet could be in serious trouble. Also what fire power have the alliance fleet got on the planet, in the form of fighters and other vessels.
That what I would say if I was analysing a real battle scene.

As this is a fiction I suspect Ciring will win this battle. But those missing ships were assign to hit a other base of more important value, something like the space docks which built the Sparrow for instant.

algesan
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by algesan » Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:49 am

Hmmm, I'm not great on ship identification for this universe, but in the last few pages I seem to be seeing at least 10 ships out there vectoring in with 5-6 directly firing on the Milowka. Now, unless the CA is calling something else a "Destroyer" rather than a BB or CL, we just had a blunder by Admiral Novosi?

Part of the usefulness of englobing depends on the ship design parameters of this universe. It might cost too much time to try to punch out or cause enough damage to the engines that maneuvering to reengage would be slow.

charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:54 pm

Image

Strewth! There's a real risk of them breaking through now. So two lances on the Light Carrier and at least one on each Battleship maybe... Unless that single lance from the side was just the Vashnir.

OUCH! Thats gotta be nasty news for the Milowka. Best I see is that its all hitting that forward hull section. Which makes sense since nearly every other Cirin ship has its bridge and stuff in the forward hull.

Well they must realise they're in a pincer move now, which means they know their only hope out at this point is to punch through the Milowka... I'm thinking the Milowka might be lost here. The Cirins are likely to still win (heck, the Vorstoks already have a bead on the Battleships) but I'm thinking it'll cost 'em the Milowka at the very least.
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Knowles2
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Knowles2 » Sat Aug 27, 2011 1:54 am

ouch that going to hurt and leave a dent in that armour.

This would would make one awsome animation/film scene ;) . An the UTC ships have some muscle on them. Cirin may just lose this battle.

charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:22 pm

Probably my only nit-pic on the latest pages is that there are no fighters anywhere. In White-rim we saw some fighters still shooting around the battleships and dodging other fighters together with point-defence. But then that was the ships jumping right into battle with each other while these guys managed to launch fighters ahead of them to dog it out before the caps came into contact... They could easily be too busy with each other elsewhere or have wiped each other out with the stragglers destroyed by point-defence.

A pity to see the Vorstok lances seem less powerful than the UTC and Darani ones (or maybe the scale, angle and distance just make it look that way). I'll be interested to see what happens when the other Vorstok hits the opposite Battleship. From memory, that one whould be more closely lined up with the Bridge, and facing a Gerushda to boot.

I wonder if the UTC command ship is one of the battleships or simply the Light Carrier.
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cbhacking
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by cbhacking » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:33 pm

Shiny! Love me some CD fight scenes.

One question: the weapon turrets are very plainly visible on the capital ships. Is it practical, given the accuracy of the weapons, the projectile speed and max range, and the speed and maneuverability of the combatants, to target the enemy weapons? We've certainly seen fighters targeting engines and thrusters, but I'm guessing the turrets may be a bit too well-armored for that. Capital weapons though... it seems like those would make high-priority targets.

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