Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

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Knowles2
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Knowles2 » Tue Aug 16, 2011 5:18 am

Congratulations.
Hmm, there are a few more Daranir ships than I thought at first. A Vashnir and two Taratanes. The Vashnir has a lance, so that could be troublesome. So the Novosi's Sparrow is the prime target and the arrogance of both the Daranir and UTC are leading them to charge in after it... and she's making herself an even more juicy target to ensure it.
Except I do not think they are going to full for it. Especially if there more commanders like that one in the fleet, who are not willing to underestimate the enemy.

mysticjim
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by mysticjim » Tue Aug 16, 2011 7:05 am

David is distracted and he soon hopes to tell us why...Sorry, I'm a serial speculator - I don't know how realistic this guess might be, but David, are you going to unveil that CD might be on the verge of being adapted for TV or film in some capacity???(Sits in the corner hoping, like an excited child on Christmas day!!!!!!) ;)

Aegeus
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Aegeus » Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:21 am

I'd really like to see a larger-scale view of the battle. A big tactical map or something. I know they're laying some sort of trap, but I have no clue what an "inverted shield formation" looks like or how it would trap someone or whether it looks like the UTC is falling for it.

Also, this war has been going on for 60 years? :shock:

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David
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by David » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:37 pm

mysticjim wrote:David is distracted and he soon hopes to tell us why...Sorry, I'm a serial speculator - I don't know how realistic this guess might be, but David, are you going to unveil that CD might be on the verge of being adapted for TV or film in some capacity???(Sits in the corner hoping, like an excited child on Christmas day!!!!!!) ;)
It's not CD related.
Aegeus wrote:I'd really like to see a larger-scale view of the battle. A big tactical map or something. I know they're laying some sort of trap, but I have no clue what an "inverted shield formation" looks like or how it would trap someone or whether it looks like the UTC is falling for it.

Also, this war has been going on for 60 years? :shock:
Next page has a tactical view of the CDF fleet.

This war has been going for just over a year, but there was a prior war roughly 60 years ago which only lasted a matter of weeks and ended with the Cirin Alliance suffering a catastrophic defeat at Ogilvey's Rift. The Republic see the battle as a glorious victory, the Alliance see it as a massacre perpetrated by a technologically superior aggressor. Either way, it's a key factor in the ongoing hostilities between the two nations leading up to this war.

charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:09 pm

Image

While the Daranir commanders (particularly those in the Sirius which was at the battle of White-rim) are likely to be more respectful of the Cirins and not fall for a trap, the UTC has plenty of arrogance carried by it's superrior technology over even the Daranir, let alone the Cirins. They'll likely fall right into this.

The UTC battleships should be the primary targets. Except for that Vashnir with it's lance, the other ships are all pretty much cannon fodder. While the Cirin's carrier has almost as much fire power as one of it's heavy cruisers, the Sirius is designed to stay out of combat and only has enough guns to prevent a frigate or light cruiser from trying to flank the battle and take her out. Against almost any heavy ships, she has no chance (while her fighters are busy elsewhere).
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Raukk
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Raukk » Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:05 am

charles wrote: The UTC battleships should be the primary targets. Except for that Vashnir with it's lance, the other ships are all pretty much cannon fodder. While the Cirin's carrier has almost as much fire power as one of it's heavy cruisers, the Sirius is designed to stay out of combat and only has enough guns to prevent a frigate or light cruiser from trying to flank the battle and take her out. Against almost any heavy ships, she has no chance (while her fighters are busy elsewhere).
I hate to break it to you but the ship on page 12.39 really looks like a Tempest, not a Vashnir (the one on 12.38 looks like a Vashnir). Also, unless the Tempest is way out front (and looking at the older pages that may be true), those UTC ships are huge. Things aren't looking good for our Crin friends.

Knowles2
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by Knowles2 » Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:34 am

That formation looks like a trap, smells like a trap and sounds like a trap. To obvious anyone with half a brain would halt there fleet movements before the rival fleet ships can move to out flank you while you and surrounds you, why you are focusing on destroying a single vessels.

You would have to be idiots to fool for it.

algesan
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by algesan » Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:34 am

Unless there is a different perspective I'm missing, I'll bet "inverted shield formation" means advancing on the "rim" as a prep to attempting to englobe the enemy.

First, a setup to make the Dar/UTC think that the CA wants to sit and wait in a defensive stance, like maybe they want to be able to run away. Second, some section of the Dar and probably all of the UTC think that the CA are low tech bozos they can stomp into the ground. Maybe some Dar think differently, but if such beliefs exist, they will (historically) be most prevalent among the senior commanders.

If I'm right, what we have is a baited trap where the enemy is seeing what he wants to see (tenative/scared enemy who don't want to come in for victory who cannot even hold a formation when under the beginning of an assault). When it is sprung, if I'm right about the "inverted shield", then the sides will come crashing down on the core of the Dar/UTC fleet attacking them from all sides, smashing escorts and restricting their fields of fire until they are crushed. Retreat in the center, hold on the flanks, then kill when the enemy overcommits. It is a popular and effective battlefield gambit. It has worked perfectly once.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae

charles
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by charles » Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:14 am

Raukk wrote:
charles wrote: The UTC battleships should be the primary targets. Except for that Vashnir with it's lance, the other ships are all pretty much cannon fodder. While the Cirin's carrier has almost as much fire power as one of it's heavy cruisers, the Sirius is designed to stay out of combat and only has enough guns to prevent a frigate or light cruiser from trying to flank the battle and take her out. Against almost any heavy ships, she has no chance (while her fighters are busy elsewhere).
I hate to break it to you but the ship on page 12.39 really looks like a Tempest, not a Vashnir (the one on 12.38 looks like a Vashnir). Also, unless the Tempest is way out front (and looking at the older pages that may be true), those UTC ships are huge. Things aren't looking good for our Crin friends.
I hate to break it to you but my post was dated August 16, the day after page 12.38 not page 12.39 so it would seem that 12.38 was the page my post was referring to at the time :P (on the other hand, you can actually see a Vashnir in panel 2 of 12.39 if you look closely). Although I did miss that they have a Tempest so certainly thats two lances they have to use against the Cirins.

The UTC caps are certainly large. But I guess they're also very flat so it can be deceptive, much like comparing the size of a pancake to the same amount of mixture as it sits in a bottle. Greater surface area, width and height but not much depth. Today's page really shows just how thin they are with that Battleship on the far left. The Tempest is out in front a way if you're able to compare the appearance of the Tempest from the front in Panel 2 of 12.39. a better comparison to one of the larger ships in the Daranir forces might be with the Sirius which is also shown in Panel 2 of 12.39 and we know its a bit further back from 12.38. We also know that the Castellan class Sirius is comparible in size to the Sparrow class Milowka, although the Castellan is wider while the Sparrow is longer at 570.6m compared to 398.2m and the Castellan holds less fighters. Those two Daimyo Heavy Cruisers are often considered comparible to the Daranir battleships as well and are certainly quite large compared with both the Tempest and Sparrow class ships. The Sparrow is almost as well armed as a Daimyo while the Castellan is very lightly armed for it's size. The middle UTC ship is a light carrier, so it's likely to have smaller armaments compared with a capital of similar size.

One thing I notice about the formation is that it puts the two Vorstoks and Gerushda, with their lances, on the flanks for easy access to the broader sides of the UTC battleships which should be much more easy to hit. The UTC/Daranir ships are also bunched up in their attack, so not much room to maneuver among each other while the Cirin ships are all over the place and have a nice grouping of targets to take aim at which can mean that even misses score good hits on a neighbouring ship... I'd also hate to see what might happen to any nearby ships when a capital ship goes boom from a direct hit by a lance like the ship in page 15 of the Prologue.
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javcs
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Re: Official "Discuss the latest page" thread

Post by javcs » Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:31 pm

I like the Cirin planning behind the Milowka's layout so far. High marks for deviousness.

Sucks to be the crew who looses their quarters and rec areas afterwards, though, but, given the alternatives, it's not that bad.

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